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Itinerary to go with school leave request


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#26 EsmeLennox

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:14 PM

Good for you, OP. Do check the school’s assessment policy if she will need any extensions.

#27 annodam

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:19 PM

You're very lucky to be given approval at all, especially in the Senior years.
At our school, no holiday leave is approved AT ALL for Yrs 11/12, all students are on Contracts.  We (the parents) are handed a call it a Contract if you will to sign at the beginning of the year to make sure we're all on board.
Now you can jump up & down all you like & by all means take the leave if you really want to but being accepted back on return is another story!
We are a Private though, so I guess they can pick & choose who they allow back into the School at the end of the day.

Last year DD who was in Yr 11 missed the final day of school (we went away for my sons 10th Birthday).
I notified the school of her & my sons absence but they still hassled me at all hours.
First it was via their 4 e-Mails during the course of the day & when they saw I did not respond to them (wasn't deliberate, I just didn't check my e-Mails) they then called me up at 6:00pm that night asking why she wasn't at school on her final day.
I gave them an earful, we very seldom take time off term, maybe a day here or there over the 15yrs she has been enrolled at the school & they fkn hounded me like I committed a bloody crime!

#28 me-and-my-girls

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:19 PM

View PostEsmeLennox, on 14 June 2019 - 08:14 PM, said:

Good for you, OP. Do check the school’s assessment policy if she will need any extensions.

I definitely will. I’m going to try and have her complete assessments early instead of asking for extensions, if possible. That way she can relax a little while we are away :)

#29 me-and-my-girls

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:24 PM

View Postannodam, on 14 June 2019 - 08:19 PM, said:

You're very lucky to be given approval at all, especially in the Senior years.
At our school, no holiday leave is approved AT ALL for Yrs 11/12, all students are on Contracts.  We (the parents) are handed a call it a Contract if you will to sign at the beginning of the year to make sure we're all on board.
Now you can jump up & down all you like & by all means take the leave if you really want to but being accepted back on return is another story!
We are a Private though, so I guess they can pick & choose who they allow back into the School at the end of the day.

Last year DD who was in Yr 11 missed the final day of school (we went away for my sons 10th Birthday).
I notified the school of her & my sons absence but they still hassled me at all hours.
First it was via their 4 e-Mails during the course of the day & when they saw I did not respond to them (wasn't deliberate, I just didn't check my e-Mails) they then called me up at 6:00pm that night asking why she wasn't at school on her final day.
I gave them an earful, we very seldom take time off term, maybe a day here or there over the 15yrs she has been enrolled at the school & they fkn hounded me like I committed a bloody crime!

This is the first year we have been in public high school. My oldest went all the way through in private and my youngest went to year 10 in private and then chose to go to the local public school to finish. And TBH it was much easier to get time off at our private school than it is proving to be now. All we had to do was fill in a bit of paper that gave the dates you’d be gone and all was sweet. But they never kicked anyone out.......they liked the $$$$

#30 ekbaby

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:39 PM

Don’t stress too much about great details on the form, it’s a standard form for all nsw schools and just a copy of the airline tickets is fine. There would be hundreds of these processed every term throughout the state, most of the time with no issues.

#31 EsmeLennox

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:44 PM

View PostWTFancie shmancie, on 14 June 2019 - 07:55 PM, said:



Some parents (and more than you would think) take their kids out of school for quite extended periods, and then carry on like pork chops when the kid's report reflects that and try to blame  the teacher for their kid falling behind and having limited understanding (or none at all) of concepts covered during their absence.

Best I know was an acquaintance who took their family overseas for the 'holiday of a lifetime!' then was p*ssed off that the school wouldn't support their application for special consideration for their HSC child.  Sorry, swanning through Europe isn't a good enough reason.

I am well aware of what goes on in schools having worked in education for 20 years. Yes, there are dubious claims for special consideration for Year 12, they are usually rejected and rightly so. It is very clear what the requirements of Year 12 are. In the case you mention, the choice to be away from school for several weeks would never be considered as cause for special consideration. Last year, the school where I work had a student’s parent want external examinations offered at a different time for their child due to another commitment. You can imagine how that ended (actually, it was quite the source of hilarity at work). I work in a school where we have pretty much seen it all in manipulating situations for personal benefit. I’ve had to provide documentation and data about students on several occasions in relation to attendance tied to Centrelink benefits and so on. Yes, there are situations where unreasonable absence needs to be dealt with and there are situations where schools need to be ‘heavy handed’ because the behaviour of parents/students are totally unreasonable. However, I’d suggest that these situations would make up a very, very small percentage of student enrolments overall.

In a situation where a family with regular attendance history and no history of manipulation of the system and a genuine effort to manage the absence is being made by parents and student (particularly in Year 11/12), then schools need to calm down and realise they are working with young human beings, and be a little flexible. Because what we see more and more are kids suffering extreme stress, anxiety and so on and I do think these issues feed into this and the way in which we send messages to kids around this ‘be all, end all’ nature of secondary education. A student needs to go away for a week in Year 11 and the parent and student works with the school to put a plan in place to manage the absence? The sky will not fall in.

Instead, what we have is increasing pressure, absurd inflexibility and so on in schools being applied indiscriminately and often without good purpose. It’s not good for our kids.

#32 Coffeegirl

Posted 14 June 2019 - 08:55 PM

View Postseayork2002, on 14 June 2019 - 04:15 PM, said:

I don't understand why I wouldn't send flight details, the agency emailed it to me and I emailed it to the principal, took all of 2 seconds and can't think of anything secret or private in it

Maybe not secret or private, but there is often enough information on an itinerary to seriously be able to mess with a person’s bookings

Booking reference and surname is usually all a person needs to login and access their tickets via the airlines website.   From there someone with malicious intent could change your flights or even cancel them.  

Same warning for people who like to post their boarding passes on FB or Instagram.   If you are a frequent flyer, your ff number is often shown on the boarding pass.  With that and a surname you could possibly get access to the account online.    With that number, a surname and DOB you could even get by a lot of phone agents and access the ff account that way.   Transfer the points to your own account

#33 Meepy

Posted 14 June 2019 - 09:04 PM

The issue of Year 11/12 attendance relates to authentication of student work (my knowledge is for VCE). The teacher must be able to show that the work is solely that of the student. To do this, teachers are required to witness students completing most tasks.  For each unit there are 50 hours minimum class time.  To assist with this schools set attendance requirements, which vary across schools-mine is 90%. Seven school days should not put the attendance under 90% so would usually be approved, if no other holidays were planned.  
It works out at 42 50 minute periods missed which is approximately 8 periods per subject - this work needs to be completed regardless.
The system was set up to take the pressure off exams at the end of the year, but it seems to spread the stress across most of the year instead.

#34 SeaPrincess

Posted 14 June 2019 - 09:18 PM

OP, they can’t physically stop you from going, but the school may list the absence as unapproved. DS went to a rugby tournament overseas, and it was marked unapproved. Our public high school sends out notices to parents if attendance falls below 91%.

#35 Keepswimming

Posted 14 June 2019 - 09:20 PM

We just sent a word doc that said "date, location x to location y" etc. There was no proof of flights or accom. The school said at a the end of the the day it's just to fulfill govt paperwork and we can't stop you from going. It was all approved. For 7 days I wouldn't worry too much.

#36 EsmeLennox

Posted 14 June 2019 - 10:36 PM

View PostMeepy, on 14 June 2019 - 09:04 PM, said:

The issue of Year 11/12 attendance relates to authentication of student work (my knowledge is for VCE). The teacher must be able to show that the work is solely that of the student. To do this, teachers are required to witness students completing most tasks.  For each unit there are 50 hours minimum class time.  To assist with this schools set attendance requirements, which vary across schools-mine is 90%. Seven school days should not put the attendance under 90% so would usually be approved, if no other holidays were planned.  
It works out at 42 50 minute periods missed which is approximately 8 periods per subject - this work needs to be completed regardless.
The system was set up to take the pressure off exams at the end of the year, but it seems to spread the stress across most of the year instead.

It’s just another absurdity that teachers have to witness the completion of most tasks (although you tend to see quite a bit anyway) that feeds more and more into the high pressure environment (for everyone...students and teachers).

#37 wannabe30

Posted 14 June 2019 - 10:44 PM

View PostKeepswimming, on 14 June 2019 - 09:20 PM, said:

We just sent a word doc that said "date, location x to location y" etc. There was no proof of flights or accom. The school said at a the end of the the day it's just to fulfill govt paperwork and we can't stop you from going. It was all approved. For 7 days I wouldn't worry too much.

We did the same:
Day 1: Flight QF123 to X
Days 2-4: stay in X city to attend family wedding
Days 5-6: travel in Y area
Day 7: Flight QF 789 home

#38 dadwasathome

Posted 15 June 2019 - 10:08 AM

View PostSeaPrincess, on 14 June 2019 - 09:18 PM, said:

OP, they can’t physically stop you from going, but the school may list the absence as unapproved. DS went to a rugby tournament overseas, and it was marked unapproved. Our public high school sends out notices to parents if attendance falls below 91%.

We have travelled twice with leave unapproved for DS16. The principal could not approve the leave with the DoE guidelines. She did speak to me and indicate that it sounded like a great trip and she hoped we enjoyed it.

We may take a couple of days at the end of this year, but DS Is very aware of all his assignment dates

The primary school has never responded to the same requests for DS11

Edited by dadwasathome, 15 June 2019 - 10:08 AM.


#39 Expelliarmus

Posted 15 June 2019 - 10:21 AM

I know it’s annoying.

So are the legal requirements education departments have in place.

But the good news is that if you do what you like anyway NOTHING HAPPENS.

If it’s unapproved or you don’t bother to put in the paperwork guess what the attendance officers do?

Nothing.

I spend half my life like a blue-a*sed fly running around getting reasons for absences for families we know their situation because site leadership go off their head if anything is left unexplained, and the ones we genuinely worry about who aren’t at school enough to be at risk from that alone don’t even get followed up by anyone.

And then as soon as my kid is late for homegroup I get a text which if I don’t respond to, they ring me. If I do t answer they email me.

Half the time my kid was actually in the room, the teacher didn’t click a button.

Meanwhile it’s been two weeks since I’ve seen two of my students and the attendance officer didn’t turn up for the appointment the well-being leader set up to follow it up.

EB - have less angst around attendance. Your stress levels will thank you.

(I now respond to my kids’ school with texts that say things like ‘he says he was there’ and ‘I dunno why he’s absent. Your guess is as good as mine. He told me here’s there now. Please check his reason for lateness with him.’)

Edited by Expelliarmus, 15 June 2019 - 10:44 AM.


#40 EsmeLennox

Posted 15 June 2019 - 10:31 AM

I know, Expelli. So. ****ing. Tired. Of. The. Beuracracy. And. Inaction.

Please won’t somone let some common sense prevail?

#41 Wot*A*Lot*Of_____

Posted 15 June 2019 - 11:23 AM

View PostSeaPrincess, on 14 June 2019 - 09:18 PM, said:

OP, they can’t physically stop you from going, but the school may list the absence as unapproved. DS went to a rugby tournament overseas, and it was marked unapproved. Our public high school sends out notices to parents if attendance falls below 91%.
Our school would have featured your DS in the school newsletter and given him help with work missed, which is what they did with DD when she went to the USA for nearly 2wks to play. They are very big on rugby, used to be very big on soccer as well until DD25 left. Then they had no girls playing at a rep level.

#42 Kreme

Posted 15 June 2019 - 11:37 AM

Oh the process has changed so much recently, I struggle to keep up! Two years ago we took out kids out of school (yr 5 & 4) for a month to go overseas and the principal said just send an email with your dates so we know they haven’t disappeared, have a lovely trip.

Last year we took them out for 4 days to go to the Commonwealth Games and sent the email. One teacher was fine, the other one carried on because we hadn’t followed proper process and asked for permission. I told him we were advising, not asking.

This year we are taking them out for 2 weeks and DD’s high school has a process on their website which includes filling in a form and providing tickets/itinerary. Which I am fine with, as long as I know what they want I will provide it.

#43 annodam

Posted 15 June 2019 - 02:27 PM

View PostWTF*A*Lot, on 15 June 2019 - 11:23 AM, said:

Our school would have featured your DS in the school newsletter and given him help with work missed, which is what they did with DD when she went to the USA for nearly 2wks to play. They are very big on rugby, used to be very big on soccer as well until DD25 left. Then they had no girls playing at a rep level.



Tournaments are considered different to trips/holidays.
if you're representing your State/Country, you're viewed an elite athlete apparently.
Same with DD last year, she went away on a Tournament & the school was completely fine with it, yet holidays are a no go zone, in Yrs 11/12.



ETA:    Yr 11/12 is vastly different to other year levels, having 2wks off in Yr 8 does not compare!

Edited by annodam, 15 June 2019 - 02:31 PM.


#44 Holidayromp

Posted 15 June 2019 - 04:01 PM

View Postannodam, on 15 June 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:





Tournaments are considered different to trips/holidays.
if you're representing your State/Country, you're viewed an elite athlete apparently.
Same with DD last year, she went away on a Tournament & the school was completely fine with it, yet holidays are a no go zone, in Yrs 11/12.



ETA:    Yr 11/12 is vastly different to other year levels, having 2wks off in Yr 8 does not compare!

Who is to say that a holiday is any less important to another student.

Yes its great that they are in a sport, awesome they are competing at a state, national level but that should diminish another’s student’s interests.

#45 me-and-my-girls

Posted 15 June 2019 - 04:08 PM

View Postannodam, on 15 June 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:





Tournaments are considered different to trips/holidays.
if you're representing your State/Country, you're viewed an elite athlete apparently.
Same with DD last year, she went away on a Tournament & the school was completely fine with it, yet holidays are a no go zone, in Yrs 11/12.



ETA:    Yr 11/12 is vastly different to other year levels, having 2wks off in Yr 8 does not compare!

It’s funny that you mention that. My DD goes to a selective sports high school. She is not in the sports program, she goes because it’s our local high school. However most kids at the school play rep sport of some sort and most train daily. Generally speaking, most kids have lots of time off for sports related reasons and of course, the school encourages it. So hopefully, we won’t have a problem getting this time off as I’m sure her attendance is much higher than most other kids.

#46 annodam

Posted 15 June 2019 - 04:24 PM

DD didn't trial this year for any Rep squad.
Yr 12 is hard enough without the added trialing & training sessions on weeknights/weekends, so she's taken a year off.
Plus, I prefer she focused on her studies anyway.
It's only a year off really, if she wants to, she can trial again in 2020.

Your daughter being in Yr 11 would not be allowed to take that time off (in the circumstances you've described) at our School, I know that for a fact.

No one said it was a fair system - just 'cause you're blessed with some talent in Sports you get time off & other students aren't allowed a basic holiday but then again, how much of life is fair?

#47 SeaPrincess

Posted 15 June 2019 - 07:49 PM

View PostWTF*A*Lot, on 15 June 2019 - 11:23 AM, said:

Our school would have featured your DS in the school newsletter and given him help with work missed, which is what they did with DD when she went to the USA for nearly 2wks to play. They are very big on rugby, used to be very big on soccer as well until DD25 left. Then they had no girls playing at a rep level.
It's a public school and just a club thing, not state representation or anything. It was a long weekend in Singapore, so he only missed 2 days. I was a bit surprised they didn't make anything of it though because they've certainly promoted other sporting achievements on their Facebook page, newsletter, etc.

#48 lizzzard

Posted 16 June 2019 - 03:28 PM

holy moly, some people like to make a mountain out of a molehill! The school is following education department guidelines in asking for some benign documentation. The likelihood of that information being stolen or used by some rogue member of staff to hack into your online booking to mess with your plans is .000000001%/. It will take the OP 2 minutes to comply with the request.

There is no conspiracy, invasion of rights, or monumental inconvenience being demanded here.

Btw, I'm not directing those comments at the OP - I suspect she originally just wanted to know what the school meant by 'itinerary' so she could provide what they were after.

#49 Expelliarmus

Posted 16 June 2019 - 04:33 PM

Ain't nobody in a school got time fer dat.

#50 SeaPrincess

Posted 16 June 2019 - 05:12 PM

View Postlizzzard, on 16 June 2019 - 03:28 PM, said:

holy moly, some people like to make a mountain out of a molehill! The school is following education department guidelines in asking for some benign documentation. The likelihood of that information being stolen or used by some rogue member of staff to hack into your online booking to mess with your plans is .000000001%/. It will take the OP 2 minutes to comply with the request.

There is no conspiracy, invasion of rights, or monumental inconvenience being demanded here.

You’d be surprised how many conspiracists are out there. I used to work for a Registered Training Organisation. Every week, we would have people book on courses, then fail to provide sufficient details for us to either upload their records to the government records system or to send them a copy of their course Statement of Attainment.




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